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Posted by Danny143 on May 23 2008, 00:57 AM GMT Aussie flavour in world cricket has become quite common these days. But the standard that they maintain in home or in the ECC are at the highest. The influnece that ECC has on Aussie players is reducing. ECC teaches you to play in more proffessional way and only "in the cricket book shots", but most of the Aussie players are sloggers. You always feel that they are playing baseball than cricket. They trend in cricket is changing and the focus is on the very limited over matches(T20). No wonder if we have one more form of the game 10:10. Players in the ECC should focus on these aspects and learn a bit of slogging than the perfect shots. IPL has become a real threat to Countys in England. With the number of foriegn players reducing in the ECC, it is becoming a sunset for them. Nottingham a team with great names has all new faces today. Posted by The_Magicians_Apprentice on May 22 2008, 03:07 AM GMT But look at the very clear example of Worcs. Bumpy Rhodes has made it very clear the way forward is with young English players - not just players who can't get into the South African National Team. Yes, first class figures may be flattering ... but what of their international careers? Let's be honest. Leics want to win trophies and the income that comes with it. Yet they have forgotten their successes in 20:20 and one-day games which was built on players like Maddy and Masters who have since left. Only Nixon seems to be left. We have a £1100 fine per non-English player in county games. About a point reduction instead?? I want to see England win the Ashes again, not just a County team possibly winning an one-off Trophy or Championship. The Kolpak ruling and the individual county understanding of it is surely working against this. Posted by drinks.break on May 22 2008, 01:56 AM GMT NeilCameron wants a "reciprocal arrangement" for OS players. That'd be fair enough if English county players could actually IMPROVE Aus state sides. The fact is, they can't. Take NSW's 1st XI: they're only 3 batsmen short of an INTERNATIONAL-strength team already - Jaques, Katich, M Clarke, Haddin, Lee, S Clark, Bracken, MacGill. The Zim players (Goodwin & Ervine) who went to Aus first had to prove themselves in grade cricket before they were allowed to play for state sides. Flower went straight into the weakest state side (SA), but then he was without doubt in the absolute top tier of international players at the time - certainly a class above Ramprakash, et al. Face it: the ECC is basically on par for quality with the Sydney grade competition. Posted by drinks.break on May 22 2008, 01:55 AM GMT NeilCameron wants a "reciprocal arrangement" for OS players. That'd be fair enough if English county players could actually IMPROVE Aus state sides. The fact is, they can't. Take NSW's 1st XI: they're only 3 batsmen short of an INTERNATIONAL-strength team already - Jaques, Katich, M Clarke, Haddin, Lee, S Clark, Bracken, MacGill. The Zim players (Goodwin & Ervine) who went to Aus first had to prove themselves in grade cricket before they were allowed to play for state sides. Flower went straight into the weakest state side (SA), but then he was without doubt in the absolute top tier of international players at the time - certainly a class above Ramprakash, et al. Face it: the ECC is basically on par for quality with the Sydney grade competition. Posted by drinks.break on May 22 2008, 01:24 AM GMT CMJ's comparison with Australian domestic cricket just doesn't hold water, because it's impossible to compare the Australian comp with the ECC. A couple of years ago I suggested on a cricinfo blog that the ECC should try to emulate Aus's 6-region comp (I'm obviously not the only one who thinks so!), because the concentration of international players you get in Aus domestic teams is something the ECC can only dream about. NSW reached the Pura Cup final this year without the services of Lee, M Clarke, S Clark, MacGill, Bracken & Jaques. How did they survive the loss of 6 world-class players? Well, they still had Katich, Haddin, & Hauritz with international experience and Thornely, Casson, Bollinger & Henriques with Aus-A experience to anchor the team. What county team can compare with that? Either the ECC goes for 6 regions as a finishing school for internationals, with 6 regional grade comps under that to identify up-&-comers, or they go the way of Leicester. Posted by MadderDog on May 21 2008, 15:52 PM GMT Kolpaks, EUs and overseas players in county cricket won't go away. What will go away will be a quality England cricket team - look to the Football Premier League as an example. An all-England clash in the top European cup competition - but with how many England qualified representatives in both starting XIs. And if it were Liverpool or Arsenal it wouldn't have been any better, maybe worse. And where's the analogy between what's happening in football to what's starting to happen in cricket, you ask? Well, England's absence from Euro 2008, to wit, the national side starting to underperform due to the paucity of available talent. Transfer that to the cricketing scenario and suddenly the national side isn't such a marketable commodity any more - or to put it in blunt terms that county chairman might understand, the cash cow starts to dry up! Of course quality overseas players help the game - it's just a question of numbers... Posted by Aditya_mookerjee on May 21 2008, 13:13 PM GMT I am a great admirer of Mr Martin-Jenkins. The first encyclopedic book which I owned, was 'The Complete Who's Who of Test Cricketers", compiled by him. Posted by tomjs100 on May 21 2008, 12:56 PM GMT Let's look at the quality of the overseas players at Leicestershire. Dippenaar: FC bat 43 Ackerman: FC bat 43 Du Toit: FC bat 38 Du Preez: FC bat 20 FC bowl 23 Kruger: FC bowl 29 Henderson: FC bat 19 FC bowl 31 (spinner) Fact is, these players are exceptional. Especially Dippenaar, Ackerman and Du Preez. The number of domestic players their equal you could probably list on one hand. I don't think Leicester will be a minor county if they start winning trophies... which they would have a good chance of if they weren't constantly fielding crap local players so people like CMJ can't bitch at them for having cheaper, better overseas players. The ECB isn't going to act over Kolpak players.... the EC was set up with the idea of free trade of goods and workers at its core. Cases like that of Kolpak are a good example of this in action, and will not be overturned. Enough CMJ. Don't start sounding like a paid up member of the BNP and quit while you are behind. Posted by RSG476 on May 21 2008, 09:33 AM GMT I think Davidson has a strong point when he refers to the influence of established pros on younger players in the side in place of journeymen. While CMJ and the cricket establishment may cringe at this, my support for Davidson comes from witnessing the effect such pros are having on talented young Indian players in the IPL. Thus Laxmi Ratan Shukla has new found confidence given the support he gets from Ponting. Shane Warne inspires a bunch of young Indian cricketers in Jaipur, and Ashok Dinda, from the back of nowhere (Medinipur in West Bengal)gets the confidence boost of playing along side people like Shoaib Akhtar. That has been one of the biggest benefits of IPL - if this can work in a 20 over game, I would imagine the benefits in a county season, as envisaged by Davidson, would be much higher. The metric for CMJ should not be the # of cricketers not qualified to play for England, but the # of cricketers in the county who graduate to do so, benefiting from the senior pros. Posted by munkeymomo on May 21 2008, 08:50 AM GMT Whilst I agree that the number of kolpaks in certain teams has reached a slightly OTT level, I feel that leicestershire have a very good point about teams with test grounds having a huge financial advantage. But, having England players in your squad is no advantage if they are off playing for England all season, and it is a testimonial to counties with England players on their books who can give them matches when not playing for their country, I mean it can't be a coincidence that once Trescothick wasn't playing internationally, we (somerset) had an amazing season (Langer helped a lot too!). But what good would it do reducing them to a minor county, so the young English players they do have no longer have the chance to perform for the selectors?
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